On this episode, we start by checking in on how we celebrated Valentine's Day. Hint: it included watching a whole lot of romcoms. Then, we flip from the lovey dovey talk to our very first heartbreak stories. We share what went wrong, what went right, and advice for any listeners currently dealing with a broken heart. Finally, we end the episode by chatting with actor Damson Idris about his latest Netflix film, Outside The Wire. We even get Damson to share a little love advice with us.
Okay, Now Listen Season 2 Episode 2 with Damson Idris Transcript
[Music In]
Scottie Beam: You're listening to Okay, Now Listen, a bi weekly show where we chat about what's on our minds, what we're bingeing and what's blowing up our timelines. I'm Scottie Beam, a media personality, content creator, music enthusiast, and also a wing connoisseur. But that will be cut short because I'm cutting out meat for about a few weeks. Go ahead, Syl.
Sylvia Obell: Oh, no, not again. Y'all, remember season one when this happened, right? It was rough. [laughter] It was rough. She was edgy. I'm gonna need y'all to pray for me.
Sylvia: I'm just getting this news with the rest of y'all.
Scottie: I am doing it.
Sylvia: Some prayers up. But yes. I'm Sylvia Obell. I'm a cultural writer, host, producer and lover of [sings] Beyoncé. Even though this woman refuses to send me an Ivy Park box. But that's neither here nor there. I'm --
Scottie: [crosstalk] Chil' I didn't get one either! I didn't get one this time.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] I'm gonna commit my love to you. I will commit my love to you regardless. I have -- just a crumb of a box, a letter in the post, maybe. [laughter] Just a little, just a little envelope. But yes. Hey, girl, we're back again. We are back, again.
Scottie: Hey girl. So, Sylvia, first of all, we passed your birthday. We also passed Valentine's Day. How are you feeling?
Sylvia: Right. It's a lot. I mean, back to back for me. But what I appreciate is, it's a lot of love. I'm feeling very loved. And you know what I love most? Let's count. Take a sip every time we say love in this episode, you might die.
Scottie: Facts.
Sylvia: So but what I, what I love the most about my birthday, Valentine's Day being so close together is that I feel so loved back to back. And what I really appreciated this year is that even though I'm single and not in a romantic relationship at all, all the other forms of love in my life were so overwhelming that I didn't even feel lacking. And I think -- and it's always been that like the friendship love and the familial -- the family love has always been there. But I think, like my self-love is finally at the place like where it really doesn't even feel lacking when I, like, see Valentine's Day happen and can't take part. It may also be because it's been about five years since I've taken part in the Valentine's Day. So maybe a bitch just got used to it. But. [laughs]
Scottie: But that's the true reward. That's the true beauty with love. I hope people don't think just because they don't have a significant other that they can't be loved.
Sylvia: Right.
Scottie: Like the the most rewarding and and beautiful and most full love is the love that you have for yourself.
Sylvia: Ooh! Absolutely.
Scottie: And I appreciate -- like Valentine's Day just ain't about the lovers. Like --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yeah, it's not about romantic love only.
Scottie: [crosstalk] It's for-- no.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] We just prioritize that.
Scottie: [crosstalk] It's for family love, friend love, love for yourself and just celebrating the fact that you are here in love with whatever it is, you know. So I that's why it's my favorite holiday.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yeah.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I know people are like, ugh. I can't believe you -- aside from my birthday, which is a holiday.
Sylvia: Oh gosh.
Scottie: I do, I do think that Valentine's Day is my favorite holiday because it celebrates love in all spaces. All, you know, all faces. Like it doesn't necessarily have to be with a man or a woman. It could just be with yourself.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yeah.
Scottie: I love self-love.
Sylvia: I love self-love too. Like we --
Scottie: [crosstalk] It's the best love. Shout out to that song by Ari Lennox and Baby Rose.
Sylvia: Oh, yes, yes. But like, no to your point, like my mom still sends me Valentine's Day card every year my big age, which I really appreciate. Like I, you know, I went -- I spent the Valentine's Day on a date with my girlfriends who's been on the podcast, Darian. We went to a drive-in.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Oooh.
Sylvia: I love -- yeah to go see Cinderella, the B --.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Cinderella.
Sylvia: The Brandy and Whitney Cin -- the only Cinderella we acknowledge. And I sang the entire time. But like I, you know, we had a good little Galentine's Date and yeah, so I loved all of it. I watched romance movies all weekend. I listened to love songs all weekend because we, me and Scottie, we are really soft when it comes to love. We are some romance -- some hopeless romantics on this here podcast. Okay?
Scottie: I am a cry -- I literally will save up my tears. I get excited to cry over movies. Like I'm like, yes, I can't wait. It's got be so sad and loving.
Sylvia: That's why I also love when a new movie is out too, because I've watched my favorite love movie so much that I don't necessarily tear up anymore when I see them. Like you know, I went through the usual classics, like Love Jones and Brown Sugar. I throw in some new ones like Sylvie's Love because I want to watch that one again just to get better -- I -- like, you know, grasp of it. And To All the Boys was my non-Black romance movie of this weekend. I only watched one non-Black romance movie this weekend. It was the finale, the third movie, Always and Forever in the installment. And I just stand Lara Jean and Peter for life. And that one made me cry because I just was like, I love these little high school kids so much. I don't know. Jenny Han thank you so much for giving us this gift of a movie trilogy To All the Boys because that really actually made my weekend as well. It was a lot to me.
Scottie: I just realized something that, I am a traitor. And --.
Sylvia: What do you mean?
Scottie: I watched love movies. Absolutely. All my love movies were white. And --.
Sylvia: My how the tables have turned. [laughs].
Scottie: It was only because -- and it's Twitter's fault. And I blame my Twitter followers. I blame y'all and it's not on me. But I asked everybody, you know, what is their top three romance films? And, you know, people were telling me about Lost in Translation and Dear John, all these white films that I missed, clearly, that I -- I didn't remember seeing. So I said --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] [laughs] Let me give this a try.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I'm gonna take some time to watch them. They were trash. Dear John is trash, guys. I'll never, ever, ever listen to y'all again. Dear John, Lost In Translation. Those only two that I watched that were white.
Sylvia: Okay.
Scottie: And of course I watch About Time. I love that film.
Sylvia: Uh!? I love About Time. About Time.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I love About Time.
Sylvia: Breaks me every time. That Rachel McAdams knows she know how to be a, a romantic lead. [laughs]
Scottie: Yes. Shout out to her. Yeah. So that's what I was doing. Yeah. I, I enjoy watching some films --
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yeah, we love watching -- I'm happy for this because let me tell you what I mean to speak to the listeners about this real quick before we pivot. Y'alle making it out to seem, like do you see the tweets when they're like, I grew up with Sylvia, but now more of a Scottie with the whites.
Scottie: Mhmm.
Sylvia: And I'm like, why -- what are y'all paying me out to be? Like they try -- I was like, just because I do my job as an entertainment reporter doesn't -- And I know these white actors and I've watched everything, white and Black doesn't mean -- don't paint me out to be one of them Black girls that only did white things. [laughs].
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right. Right.
Sylvia: Just cus I knew a few names. But no, like that --.
Scottie: Yeah.
Sylvia: I was that because just y'all still be tweeting that sometimes. And I'm like, what are they -- what does this mean? What does this mean?
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right. Ignorance of choice.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Please put some respect on my HBCU degree. [laughs]
Scottie: [crosstalk] The choice that I can make. Right. It was a choice that I wanted to make that I've been dedicated to, you know, and it's an ignorance that I don't mind keeping until my death. So that's fine.
Sylvia: Sorry. I had to take that little aside. But the bigger point here is that we love all love movies and romances. If that's the theme, if that's the genre we will press play. We may not like it, but we will press play. But I love that that's what we both did on Valentine's Day. Even if it was me doing it alone and you doing it with a lover. [laughs]
Scottie: Yes. We just celebrated love --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] It's a spectrum.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Romance. It was beautiful. Yes, I had a great time.
Sylvia: So you're on cloud nine. Are you feeling? Are you feeling love?
Scottie: [crosstalk] I am! I love him so much!
Sylvia: [crosstalk] I didn't, I didn't ask you how you're feeling after Valentine's.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Yes!
Sylvia: [crosstalk] You love him so much!
Scottie: [crosstalk] I love him so much. He's so great.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Awww.
Scottie: He's just so -- such a great person. He really is. He's, you know, love gives you the space to, you know, explore this person as a human being. And I am learning that I love all aspects. You know, even if they get on my nerves, they help me see clearer. And I appreciate that. And I love that about finding love with a person. So, yeah, it's great. I, I felt safe and I loved that. That was really dope.
Sylvia: Whew. Y'all --
Scottie: Stop. Okay.
Sylvia: Is it just me? I felt the listeners --.
Scottie: [crosstalk] No. [laughs]
Sylvia: I'm just, I'm just so proud because you know, as somebody who used to have to hide Scottie's running sneakers in my own closets, [laughter] I'm just so proud of the growth that has happened there. And I love seeing my friends in love. Like I love to see my friends in love.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Me too.
Sylvia: And that's one of the other things. I love Valentine's Day. I'm just so happy for you bitches because I was in the trenches when we were just yelling out Waiting To Exhale lines. And I mean, we still do.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Mhmm. We still do.
Sylvia: But like, I was in that I was in the trenches with y'all. And speaking of the trenches of heartbreak and disaster.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Let's get into this shit.
Sylvia: We want to like -- we want to go opp -- I feel like it's very like on brand to talk about love and this and that and just the beauty of it all on Valentine -- after Valentine's Day. But we want to talk the about the real --.
Scottie: [crosstalk] The ugly.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] The ugly.
Scottie: The ugly of it all.
Sylvia: The Heartbreak Hotel.
Scottie: The messy.
Sylvia: The heartbreaker.
Scottie: Chil'.
Sylvia: You got the best of me. [laughs]So let's do it. Let's talk about some of our heartbreaks and heartaches.
[Music In].
Scottie: Let's do it. Let's get into it, please, guys. You know, let's let's tackle this together. Alright?
Sylvia: Alright.
[Music Out].
Sylvia: So let's get into it. This is a safe space where -- of vulnerability and transparency. And I want to ask you, my sister, Scottie when was the first time you experienced heartbreak?
Scottie: The first time I experienced heartbreak was it was a few years ago. Probably seven years ago. Sorry, if it's blurry. I don't remember the years. I can't give you years. But it was when me and my very serious boyfriend, very committed relationship was put to an end because of cheating. He cheated on me. And boy, did I feel like a fool. My God. Like I -- what I did was I know, you know, people like what happened? Well, what happened was --.
Sylvia: [laughs] What happened, girl?
Scottie: I knew -- well, this man done went on a trip and with his friends and one of his friends was like a super duper luber cuber senior. Like he's been a senior for eight years so --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Ooop, I didn't know where that statistic was going.
Scottie: The moment that he graduated, everybody went down to celebrate this moment because they thought it would never come. So they went, had a good time, whatever. But I just knew. I had that feeling. And listen, I don't go through phones. I don't -- unless my heart knows. This is it. Something is wrong. And what I did was, I knew passcode. We all know their passcode but, you know, we don't need to go through their phone. But kicked his phone over to me on my side of the bed. Actied like I was going to the bathroom, kicked it over another side.
Sylvia: You kicked --
Scottie: [crosstalk] Picked up the phone.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] You kicked his phone?
Scottie: Yeah, because the phone was on the floor. Like --
Sylvia: Oh, oh! Charging?
Scottie: Yes, charging. So I had kicked--.
Sylvia: This is back before niggas could afford nightstands. [laughs]
Scottie: Right. [laughs] Kicked the phone --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Kicked it?! [laughter]
Scottie: Kicked the phone over to the other side picked up the phone, went through it, saw what I needed to see. And then woke him up 5:00 in the morning with my stuff all packed. I -- He didn't wake up, not once. My stuff was packed. And then I said, take me home. He was frazzled. Just, what? What is go -- what is? Take me home now. Like there is no conversation. I want to go home. And so he's like, what? What? Who did you talk to? What -- I said, I already know something happened. Be --
Sylvia: Hmmm.
Scottie: If I didn't even go through the phone, you would already tell me because you're guilty. You can -- the way you are speaking to me right now just shows that you have something you want to tell me and you couldn't. And although, you know, we're really close, we're we were best friends. Like before we were in a relationship. We were really close.
Sylvia: Yeah.
Scottie: So I just was more hurt that, how? How did you -- and I could just tell by his face and how he was talking to me, you know, I love you, right? I really love you. I love you so much. You know I love you. Huh? So.
Sylvia: Just telling on himself.
Scottie: I knew. Yeah. So he took me -- we were driving home. I didn't say anything. He was very afraid because I thought I had this idea of what I would do when I found out I was cheating on - cheated on. Like I thought I was going to break some windows, you know, I was leave some clothes --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Break some windows out the car.
Scottie: Now, don't get it fucked up y'all, I have done that before. Yes. [laughter] But not this time. This time I just wanted to go home. I just, I just wanted to see my mom. That was it.
Sylvia: Mmm. That's when you -- that's when, you know the hurt is real, when you slide past anger and just go to just disappointment. And just like the ple -- like, that's when, you know, you were in lo-o-ve.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right. So we get to the house and I say, my last little -- I forgot what The Color Purple line is, until you do right by me. That, that shit right there!
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Oh! With the -- Whoopi with the fingers pointed. [laughter] To you. You wait -- wait. You you --.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I did one of those.
Sylvia: Did you do the fingers when you said it?
Scottie: No, no, no, no, no.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Oh okay. [laughs]
Scottie: But I pointed. Like I pointed. I didn't do this. [laughter] Pointed --
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Point with one finger. [laughs]
Scottie: Right. Until you do right by me, Nothing! Everything you will ever have will crumble. Or something like that I said. And then I walked out. But the crazy thing is it was like 6:00 in the morning. My ex, let's call him Troy. Troy drives away.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Oh yes. [laughs]
Scottie: We have names, whatever. Troy drives away. My mom pulls up at 6:00 in the morning at the house. She was out all night partying with my aunt.
Sylvia: Oh!
Scottie: And she just came home.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Not living -- not living a better life. [laughs]
Scottie: But I was so happy to see her, I collapsed in the parking -- I mean, in the driveway.
Sylvia: Aw.
Scottie: And I was so sad, I cried. I cried. I cried. I cried. And my biggest mistake ever was asking, what did I do? What did I do?
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Mmmm.
Scottie: Like, it was never attacked -- attack on him. I was extremely upset but I was so focused on what I did that would make him do something like this.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Right.
Scottie: I thought if I did all the things that a good girlfriend does, that I wouldn't have to get that kind of treatment. That's what we were taught.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Right. It was a lie. It was a lie.
Scottie: And that's what I -- I did. I was one hund -- it was a super lie.
Sylvia: Yeah.
Scottie: But it was one hundred percent commitment. It was the first time that I've ever put both feet in and did my heel toe inside of love and then got slapped with reality. And that, boy, that took me -- that took me on a ride. Now, you tell me your first time, your first experience.
Sylvia: My first heartbreak, it's the first -- or the first time I experienced heartbreak. It's it's a little layered because like, in that -- that was a long relationship that had two break ups. Like one in the middle and then one at the end. Right. But the very first heartbreak, I was much younger. I was, I was 17. I was 17 years old when I -- when we broke up that first time in high school. This was my high school sweetheart. We started dating right before my 16th birthday. So we were like, even the fact that we had made it from, you know, 10th to 11th grade and you know, he was a senior. I had gone to prom with him. Like, you know, like all of these things. That, that's a big deal in high school that had made it that long or whatever. But I couldn't even tell you -- that's how I know I'm getting old and because my first heartbreak was when I was 17, I don't even remember specifically how it happened. But what I remember -- what I -- I remember that he broke up with me. But I don't remember how he broke up with me, which is a -- ladies, let this be lesson to you, that you will get through it. But like - but like, I --.
Scottie: Right.
Sylvia: I don't remember how it happened, but I do remember going home and just coll -- my bedroom was like the basement in the apartment, like that me and my mom, my sister lived in. And I just went to the basement and like collapsed on the ground. Like just laid out -- like, like, you know, laid prostrate out on the ground and just sobbing, sobbing. To the point that when my sister -- when my little sister came home, I remember her saying to me, this is what I remember most, is like her being like, I thought you were dead, Like I thought I was going to have to call 911 or something. Like I didn't even know -- and my sister and I are eight years apart. So I probably traumatized the poor girl. She was like, if I was 17 she was like 10 -- no, 9. So like, she -- no, sheshe was like if this is love, I don't want it. But I was devastated. I just remember how I felt. And I think the first heartbreak hurt so much for me, not because -- he didn't cheat. There was like no cheating. It was just that the idea that somebody could love you like that and then stop. It was like, because I was so young, like that was -- like those two things, I didn't realize that, like once -- that you could and then you couldn't. That you can start and then you can't. You know, like the idea that, like, suddenly everything that we had just experienced, all the feelings we had felt, all like the little history we had like, how does that suddenly mean nothing to you?
Sylvia: And I think the heart -- the first heart break was so hard for me because it was, I didn't have the reference point of the I could get past it. Like that first heartbreak hurt so much because I didn't know -- like after that, like with I -- when I got my heart broken, I at least could look back and be like, you've made it through this before. You can make it through this again. That first heartbreak, baby, when you don't know shit?! Aha! You're like, I don't want it, I'm done! I'm going to be single forever. My life is over. And I was a teenager, so, you know, I was extra dramatic. And I -- it - and I think the interesting thing is that with that breakup and how he -- what after he broke up with me that he literally a week or tw -- like two weeks later was posting some new chick on MySpace to date myself in --.
Sylvia: Violence.
Sylvia: In the zip up that I bought him from Against All Odds with my hard earned money! High school pennies. And he's gonna pos -- change his profile picture to him and her.And I'm like --.
Scottie: Violence. So what happened after is what I'm asking you.
Sylvia: So what --.
Scottie: What'd you do after that?
Sylvia: Well, here's the prob -- all I did was crying, write sad poetry, Scottie.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Aww. I --.
Sylvia: And literally I'm not a-- but you know what? I have fightin' friends who was like, listen, but that -- you know that's not me. I'm very much like --.
Scottie: It don't got to be you. It could be me.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] I didn't -- [laughs].
Scottie: [crosstalk] It don't have to be you. It could be me.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] I had a Scott -- and listen. And the Scottie friend in my life at that time, Ayasa, who is really --.
Scottie: Have you lost your mind?
Sylvia: Who was really there, like literally was like, girl what? No. And so when we went -- I remember like when we was -- cus the hard thing about high school breakups are in hometowns is like you have to still see each other. And like I literally was like, I have to see him out with this chick. And it felt like every time we happened to be at the same place, like people wanted to fight about it. It was drama. You know, like this, this and that. But I just really, to me, I guess why it was so difficult was that I didn't see it coming. And that, like, I don't really know -- because we were in high school. We were kids. Like I don't really know the real reason he broke up with me at that point. But I do know that a year later he came back. And was like, I want to, I want to try again. I messed up. I messed up. The other girl, I -- she wasn't you. And all -- she was so intimidated by you the whole time we were together and like, she just would never stop talking about you. And she was just intimidated by what we had. This, this and that. And to me, I'm like, okay, so, you loved me. You stopped loving me? Or you pretended like you stopped loving me and then now you love me again? And of course because like, even in the way it went, like we kind of worked our way back to, like, slowly, like he had to earn it. Like he would, like, come to my job and like, at the mall and like, bring me lunch. Or like I remember when my parents -- when we were moving from the apartment we lived in into the house because my mom getting remarried, like he came and he helped us move. And, like, you know, he was doing all these things and trying to get in good. He's going stuff, you know, popping up at church, this, this and that. And it was just like, okay, I love it. I'm sorry. I just -- you know, like, let's do it again. And then we stayed together for, like, through college through half of my college career. Like and he moved to Greensboro to be with me in North Carolina. And I think the, the breakup that happened, the breakup that happened after we had like spent a year or two in North Carolina basically playing house, essentially, you know, while I was getting my college degree, was that that's the one I remember clearly because it was the final one. But it was also the one where I had the clarity of, like, we're outgrowing each other. And the end -- at the last six months of it, we both were kind of like, we probably shouldn't be together anymore but we've come so far, how do we just throw that all away? Was I think what happened. And it was -- and that breakup was so -- like you ever had to, like, unpeel yourself from somebody? I think Gwyneth Paltrow called it uncoupling but like, I feel like the second breakup actually took months. I don't know if anybody can relate to that, where it's like, me being like, I can't do this anymore. I need you to not be here when I get back or something like that. You know what I mean? I remember just like, you know, being in my dorm room and then being like, bro, like, you need to get your -- I think I was frustr -- I remember being frustrated because you know me, I have my shit together.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yes.
Scottie: And I think it was becoming clear to me was that I was on a certain path. I was like, I am now, you know, a junior in college. I want to go to New York. I want to go -- move back to a big city and be this journalist and like, you know, do these things and go into entertainment. And like, I had these big dreams. And he couldn't even like, I think I was frustrated that I couldn't even get him to, like, go to class, you know what I mean.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right.
Sylvia: Or like, take his school seriously. And I'm just like, how -- if I can't do these things with you, how are we going to, like, do a life later, you know what I mean?
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right.
Sylvia: Or like, or focus. And I think I had to realize that I was trying to make him somebody that would fit my life and that he was trying to be somebody who would fit my life. But that's not really who he wanted to be.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right.
Sylvia: That's not really who he was. And there was nothing wrong with the fact that maybe he just wanted a simple life.
Scottie: When did you realize that love was not enough, though? Like, do you remember the time specifically when you said, okay, this needs to end where, you know, the -- not the first break, but the second breakup where you said --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yeah.
Scottie: Okay, clearly we love each other and love is it. But obviously love is not going to be enough to to sustain this relationship.
Sylvia: I realized love wasn't enough when all the other things started to collapse. Like just like the respect -- the responsibility. There was a time where he actually, because like living situations, he was like low key staying -- going back and forth between staying with a friend and being in my dorm. Right. And like I had one of those dorm that was like a suite. So it was like, you know, I had my own room within the dorm, but it was still like a dorm room with like a twin size bed and not much space.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right, right.
Sylvia: And I remember just feeling very claustrophobic. Like like I just felt like I couldn't breathe at a certain point. I was looking around and I'm like, I love this man, but my God, like, this is this is crazy.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Yeah.
Sylvia: This is crazy! You know what I mean, like, this is out of -- like, you know, when you have those moments, like, is it me or is this crazy? You know, like I definitely was feeling like that. But I think for me, I loved him so much. I think Bell Hooks in her book All About Love says it like connect. Like we were con -- like that we connected. I'm saying, I don't know if I'm using the tense right but we were attached to each other in that way our whole lives. It almost just feels like our lives were so molded together because we got together at the same time when my parents were getting divorced. And I don't think emotionally, I don't think I realized emotionally how much I transferred my dad being the man in my life to him, becoming the man in my life. I remember in that dorm room that night being like, I can't do this anymore. Gotta go. Like, please be somewhere else when I come back. But then I also remember then being weak for like a weeks later. Like, be like okay, so like, yeah, you -- we can still share the car till you figure something else out. Or like we can still do this or that. And then it was like ultimately he had to walk away at the end too, because I just have a hard time letting go of people. Like that's -- I think that's why it's so difficult for me sometimes even pinpoint the breakups. Because I believe my abandonment issues from when my dad left made me never want to make somebody feel like that. So like we ultimately, like, had to cut it off cold, you know what I mean? And it was devastating to me. And I think that was -- I think I -- it was very, it was all very confusing for me at the time because it was devastating, even though I knew it was necessary and I didn't know how to make sense of those emotions. But I think to your point, it comes back to like realizing that the love isn't enough. And that's so sad.
Scottie: I've realized that when, you know, the crying was over, because, you know, my mom would say, like, give yourself a week to cry about it. And then you will get back. You know, you got to figure out what you're going to do. I noticed that I cannot multitask. Not good at it. So when I'm in something, I'm in it. And everything else is on the back burner, which was horrible.
Sylvia: Yes. Whoo!
Scottie: When we broke up, when I -- you know, when I left, I cut off conv -- like there was no way to reach out to me. I was not accessible. There was no way for you to get in contact unless like you had hit your friend -- I even blocked his friends, except for one, because me and him are actually like cool. Everybody else got blocked. And I wanted no nothing. I didn't want to -- I just needed to figure out what I was going to do. That lasted a whole year. Because I -- not only was a grieving relationship that was romantic, but I was also grieving a friendship. That's when I put thing -- that on the backburner. And then I started to focus on my career. And I was hell bent. Like I was, I wasn't going to do nothing else, I wasn't going to think about nothing else. I wasn't going to, you know, I properly grieved for like a few weeks. But after a month or two? I was like everything else, it has gone black. I don't remember anything else, I'm not going to think about anything else. I'm going to work my ass off, work so much that I don't have to think about it. Figuring out what I wanted to do and, you know, find out what makes me happy and do all these things. Like I was, I was outside. I was outside. What I did realize was, you know, so things always come back. I'm just cutting --
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Right. Cus that's what I'm about to ask you, when did you --.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I know I'm getting straight to.
Sylvia: When did you realize oh, shit! I thought I -- I thought I was over it. But I'm not.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Well, you know, a lot of those thing--.
Sylvia: Cus these boys are boomerangs, baby. [laughs]
Scottie: Yeah. The -- the distractions won't heal you. And I thought that those distractions would be able to give me the healing that I needed. And that's not what you do. I --
Sylvia: If you are bleeding from that sentence. You are not alone. Continue. I'm speaking to the people.
Scottie: And --.
Sylvia: You shot. You shot, you shot us. [laughs]
Scottie: I used, I used my work as the biggest distraction, although I love it very much. I know part of it was because of heartbreak and because I refused to let him win there. And in my head, you know, like you see the Michael Jordan meme that says, and I took that personally. I really took that personally. [laughter] I took that personally. And --
Sylvia: So you bossed up. You were like, I'm a win the breakup. You bossed up. Yeah.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I said I'm going to win. I'm going to get better. I'm going to be better. But emotionally, I wasn't. And I realized that when somebody reached out to me and said, you know, Troy's, Troy's mom is not doing well. You know, hey, you might want to -- okay, cool. So I reached out. I unblocked and reached out. And after a whole year, I would think he was over it. You know, I always assumed niggas be over it, oh whatever. I thought I was going to see a new and improved --
Sylvia: You, you a bad bitch, sis. You a bad bitch. What you expect? [laughs] Okay.
Scottie: Well -- But when he broke down, that's when it sucked me back in. And, you know, I said, well maybe, well maybe --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Well maybe.
Scottie: [crosstalk] That's when the well maybes is coming.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Whoo!
Scottie: Well, maybe we can figure this out. Maybe we can turn this into something. Maybe, you know -- but not realizing that through that year, although I did have dist -- distractions and I was working, I did grow. I grew a lot. And what I wanted in a man changed that year later. Also, you know, I'm not gonna lie to you on here because I refuse to lie. I just can't. Yes, we try to make it work. One year, then we break it off. We don't speak for two months. We try to make it work the next month. Then we break it off for another two months. We try to make it work --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] It's messy. Yeah.
Scottie: [crosstalk] The -- after those two months. We break -- it literally was off and on for years. For years. And it's because we thought that love would be enough. That love was going to make up for all the pain that you've caused me. Love was going to make up for, you know, the expectations that we had for each other. Love was going to make up for possibly anything that drove me crazy about him. And same thing for me, I'm sure. But he was able to make that adjustment better than I could. You know, he was fine with me being a different person. I just wasn't fine with him not being the different person. I know that sounds so --.
Sylvia: No.
Scottie: But I wanted -- I did want him to change. I wanted him to grow up. And although he may have grown up in a different aspect, something different, I was expecting something completely different. And my growth was way more important than the love we had for each other. It was way too important.
Sylvia: And baby, that's the difference maker for a lot of women. It's not lost on me that like, why does my career always go so much better when I'm single --.
Scottie: Always.
Sylvia: Than when I'm in a relationship?
Scottie: I had to change that. Yeah, that was something that had to change too. Because I don't know what that -- why my prioritize -- like literally priorities get --.
Sylvia: Like how do we -- like learning how to do both. Now, I'm like well God not -- sometimes I wonder like will God not give me the person who's for me until I learn how to do both so he knows I can handle the relationship and not lose myself in it.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right.
Sylvia: And he's waiting for me to be mature enough to be able to balance that?
Scottie: Please don't ever lose yourself.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Ever lose yourself because they do.
Scottie: Or become that person thinking that if you be more like him, be more like her, then it'll make him or her love you more. And then you lose sight of yourself completely. You don't know who the fuck you are. What interests you. And not break --
Sylvia: We went through that so you don't have to go through that.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Right. So that when you know, finally you're left alone with yourself, you can only like the things that he likes, she likes. So now, now you miss her and him more because you don't have anything for yourself. What do you have for yourself?
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Chil', baby girl.
Scottie: What have you given yourself? And that's, and that's like super important because I know that there's people that get -- just they become fucking --.
Sylvia: Sorta wrapped up, wrapped up.
Scottie: Wrapped up in, in sponges of love, they suck in everything. Suck in who they are.
Sylvia: And there are partners who will happily suck everything out of you if you allow them to.
Scottie: Oh have no problem doing it. They don't notice it.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Have no problem with it. So -
Scottie: Right. They have no problem with it. They think it's better and it's less of a convenience, you know, and it's -- it's less of an inconvenience for them. So they like, okay, if you like what I like, that makes sense now. No, you goin' get me. This is what I like. This is what we, you know, I like to do. You don't have to do it with me but this will continue to happen whether you're here are not. And I hope everybody takes that with them. Please keep things for yourself. It's okay to share them, but be able to make sure you make some things your own. Yes, y'all are one but you are also one, too. I know people like we are one when we're together. Yes. But it's also two different human beings, two layered human beings.
Sylvia: Yeah. We talk a lot about the baggage that you can bring in relationships because of breakup or heartbreaks. But I don't think we often talk enough about, like, the good things that come from it, too, like how it makes you -- how it can -- the lessons from it can make you a better lover. Because I think for me, the question I kept asking myself was, how can you love me so deeply and then leave?
Scottie: I don't know. I think for the -- for, you know, that relationship with Troy, I was very much like, okay, he loves me. He said, you know, he wants to be with me.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] He'll stay. He'll stay. Oooh --
Scottie: He'll stay, okay. So I can do -- I'll do whatever I want. I can do whatever I can do to keep this relationship. Be good, be great, stay committed, do these things that you're supposed to do. Be great. And I'm still, you know, and then that slap in the face. So it's like, oh. Clearly I'm not great enough. I think after that relationship, I decided to throw these niggas away. And get rid of them before they do something to hurt me. I callused myself.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yeah.
Scottie: Basically make sure that I had some type of armor whenever I come in. And I think this is the first relationship where I'm trying not to do that because I really don't want to mess this up. And I know this is just me being young Deanii again, because sometimes I have that conversation with young me. Where I'm like, girl, you're worth it. You're enough. You don't have to try to prove it every time to get him to stay, to get him to be here. He just wants to be here. It really all comes down to being gentle with yourself. And that's something I just haven't -- I've I'm trying still.
Sylvia: Or trusting that the right man for you will be gentle with you and will love you enough to chip away at your armor.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Yeah.
Sylvia: You know, and love you while you take -- while you take your time taking off each piece of it.
Scottie: But sometimes I think maybe do they -- are they supposed to do that? Should they be doing that? Like, aren't I supposed to come ready? Like that-- and that's another thing. Like I was like, before getting in this relationship that I'm in now, I was like, do -- am I supposed to be armorless? And I can't. I don't have that quality.
Sylvia: I think there's a way of like -- there's there's layers to it because like at this point, like there's, there's the toxic half of it where it's like you bring in your baggage and you -- the other person pays like actively for the mistakes of the last person. And that's not what we're saying.
Scottie: [crosstalk] That's not good. Yeah.
Sylvia: That's not what should be happening. That's not good. But I mean, just the part of somebody maybe needing to be patient with you while you take your time to trust them. I don't think that's asking a lot. I mean, you know, I think especially at this point in our lives, we're in our 30s. Everybody we meet now is going to come a little something. There's a process of healing. But I don't think of healing as an end point. I think of it as a journey that you just continue on and it's always flowing and it ebbs and flows and it grows. And you should always have forward movement but you should never feel like there's some destination you should be at before you deserve to be loved.
Scottie: Yes, I hear that.
Sylvia: What advice would you give somebody dealing with heartbreak right now?
Scottie: Feel it. Don't fight it because there's going to be a time -- oh, boy. Where you say, I made it. I'm ab -- you're resilient. You will make it out of this. If you fight it, you'll never know. You don't know what you can put your heart through too. And you gave yourself the vulnerability to love and opened your heart up to love. Now you've got to have your heart experience some pain. And figure -- and your heart has to learn how to deal with pain. And that's how you, you have to feel through it. You will come through a better person. You will do it. It will happen. On its own time, too. Don't think that because you you know, you waiting for karma to hit him. You, you'll sleep better that day. No. [laughter] No, no, no, no. Work on your own time. Work on your own healing. If that takes blocking him to Timbuktu, literally do -- just no communication with him at all. That works. But I need you to feel through this. You are grieving.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] It's a real grieving process. Yeah.
Scottie: This is a loss of a relationship. It is a real process. And there'll be a moment where you will look up and say, oh, yeah, that happened, but I'm better because it happened. Do what you -- do what you need to do to make sure you know that that love was real. It wasn't fake. And that it deserves to be grieved. And that's it. What would you give? What advice?
Sylvia: Whew! Child. I think, I mean, you -- you you hit so many. I was like, dang. That's what I was gonna say.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I know, I'm sorry. I'm just like -- [laughter].
Sylvia: [crosstalk] I was like, leave an advice for me! No. [laughter]
Scottie: [crosstalk] Sorry. Just --
Sylvia: But I, I do think like to in addition to everything you said, my overall thing is that you are going to be a better person because of this. And you -- this is not -- I think my advice is like it -- heartbreak sometimes feels so much like the end all be all in that moment. Like just the end of a life. And it is the -- and it is, in a way, an end of maybe a life you imagined. But that doesn't mean it's the end of your life or the actual life --.
Scottie: [crosstalk] It's the end of the idea.
Sylvia: It's the end of the idea. You're grieving the fantasy. You're grieving the you know, the the the scenarios you've played in your head. But what I always trust is that I know that God has a better and bigger plan for me than I have for myself. And if I know that each time it gets better and it's like, wow, if I love this much this time and you mean -- think of it like, there is still better waiting for you. And how crazy is that? Your heart is resilient.
Scottie: Yep.
Sylvia: It is more resilient than you think. Trust it as a muscle. I kind of think of it like when you get an injury and you have to go to like personal tr -- you have to go to physical training for it. Like and you know, when they go back in the game for the first time, it's like they always giving the advice, like you -- trust your knee, trust your arm or whatever it is that you injured.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Mhmm.
Sylvia: Like it's going to do, it's going to do what you want to do. But you have to let go of the fear that it won't.
Scottie: Yes.
Sylvia: And I think the same thing about a heart in a breakup. It's like a heartbreak. It's literally your break, right, it's -- it's an injury. And when you, you -- when you heal it, when you do the work to heal it, you then have to go out back into the game trusting that your heart will do what it was made to do. And so my -- what I want to say to people who are heartbroken right now that your heart will do what is made to do. It will heal.
Scottie: [crosstalk] It will heal.
Sylvia: It will love again, and you will still have a beautiful life. And you, like our mamas, and us now, we'll look back at either of you right now and be like, girl, if only you knew. Like I sometimes I have to, like, think that to myself. Like, did I imagine the future me was going to be, you know, living in a beautiful apartment in L.A.? And like having all these things happening in my life? No, but that's the point. It is better. It does --
Scottie: [crosstalk] That's the point.
Sylvia: And my version of better won't be yours but it will still be better. And these boys, man, these niggas are not everything. Or these women are not everything. Or they -- the people that you love, you know, the get across the whole spectrum. The person you love is not -- they're not your whole life.
Scottie: [crosstalk] They can't. It's impossible.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] They feel like your life but they're not. And it's so -- it's impossible.
Scottie: [crosstalk] You can't.
Sylvia: Life for so long and we only get one of them. Do not -- do not waste your life. Sometimes I have to think to yourself -- myself, how dare you? Like sometimes I tell myself, like look at myself in the mirror, like how dare you waste this life? How many people do you know who haven't even -- never even got to make it to the age you are right now? How dare you waste your life crying over somebody who thinks you're expendable? They're not for you. But trust that the right person is out there and it may not come when you want it or you think or this or that. But the number one prioritizing person that you need to make sure loves you is you.
Scottie: Mhmm.
Sylvia: So work on that. And everything else will fall into place.
Scottie: Fall into place. You just got to give it time. Please practice patience. Please.
Sylvia: And pay attention to the people who are there for you in this moment, because that's what taught me about friends soul mates and great loves not being limited to romantic relationships because the love -- my girls are the love of my life, at this point. And I'm sure I will add another love to my life. But, you know, there's a lot of love around you. And so pour yourself into the other loves that are around you and you will realize that you're not as lacking for love in the moment as you think you are.
[Music In]
Scottie: Breakups are tough. And sometimes you just need an escape from it all. I mean, since vacays are limited right now, I really recommend movies. Like movies are my number one thing to watch. I -- the same way we watch all these rom-coms when we're feeling all lovey dovey.
[Music Out]
Scottie: You got to cut that shit off sometimes when you go through a breakup because you'll end up texting that person or doing something that you ain't supposed to do. So I highly recommend watching some action movies when you're just not with the shit. When you want some violence but you know, you're going to go to jail. [laughter] So you can't really execute it physically. You need to see it on the screen. You know, there's violence, explosions. Just a great way to channel that heartbreak energy.
Sylvia: Choosing violence in a safe way on your screen versus in your actual life --.
Scottie: [crosstalk] That's right.
Sylvia: Is the violence we're choosing here.
Scottie: [crosstalk] That's right.
Sylvia: You know, a good explosion on the TV screen can really stop you from exploding in the texts. Okay?
Scottie: [crosstalk] That's right.
Sylvia: Outside the Wire on Netflix is actually a great choice for that. It's got explosions, it's got violence, and it's set in the future where your future boo is waiting for you as well. What more can you ask for?
Right. Right. Because, I mean, Outside the Wire would have been what I had to watch in order not to bounce your boyfriend, your ex-boyfriend’s head like a basketball after I seen the girl with the sweater on, I would have lost my shit, okay? So I would have definitely been watching Outside the Wire. I'm glad we got to sit down, though. Because we got to talk to Damson Idris to talk about his movie and so much more. Check it out.
[Music In].
Scottie: OK, so welcome. So first, I have to ask you, before we get into everything, how is your heart, Damson?
Damson Idris: It's great, man. You know, the movie is doing great. It's number one in -- I think they said 74 countries. And we're doing season four of Snowfall right now. So we started, we started back off our hiatus. We've got about a week left to shoot. And yeah, we walked in to work yesterday and everyone from catering to everyone, they'd all seen Outside the Wire. And they're like Damson? Thank you for saving the world, kid! [laughter] You know, it -- the future is bright.
Scottie: Yes. And it's currently number one on Netflix top ten in the U.S. Talk to us about how you came across this project Outside the Wire. What drew you to it?
Damson: Well, I was in -- I was, I was in L.A. filming. And then we'd wrapped season three and there was a bunch of projects on the horizon. But I didn't really know, I didn't really want to dove into another role that was so dark. I think season three was was quite dark. And I'd come off Farming and Black Mirror and the police shooting racial tension themes of Twilight Zone. It was like a heavy -- my credits would just get heavier and heavier. I said I -- [laughter] I want to have some fun. So I was in London. And this project came across my desk and I sat down with Director Mikael over Zoom. This is before the pandemic. Now Zooms are all we have. And then, you know, he spoke to me about the movie, spoke to me about what he wanted to do. I was always a fan of Anthony Mackie. I loved the script. So I jumped at the opportunity man. And I will say everything I've done, this has been my most fun I've had filming on anything. So that's great.
Sylvia: We love fun. I love that.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I'm always here for joy.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Cus we need to have -- we need to balance the joy with the pain and the sad -- it's just a lot. It's a lot to be Black in the world right now. We need to have fun when we can.
Damson: Yeah, I'm running out that one glory tear, man. I put -- [laughter] I put it out a lot.
Sylvia: Your tear ducts are tired. They are tired. [laughs]
Damson: Yeah, man. Let's show some teeth. Let's show some teeth.
Sylvia: So your character Harp in the movie is sort of a hot headed guy. You know, even though he's super talented at what he does, he isn't great with taking direction. Sorta like a co-host, I know.
Wow.
What kind of --. [laughs]
[crosstalk] That's crazy. I knew it was coming. I knew it was coming. I knew what's coming, Damson. When I said -- I said, oh, here comes. The shot.
Sylvia: It was like, the more I thought about it, I was like, who does this remind me of?
Scottie: [crosstalk] When I was watching it --.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] In the work place? [laughs]
Scottie: [crosstalk] Well Harp is me. I am Harp. I woulda took the shot, regardless.
Damson: This in the morning. Shade like that. Wow. [laughter]
Sylvia: We come out. [snaps] I told you what it is. We're at brunch. And just get your mimosas so. But what attracted you to this kind of character? I mean, you mentioned the joy part, but like also just like playing this soldier.
Damson: Yeah, well, it was unlike anything I've done before. Harp was a character who I knew as a, just as a viewer and as a Black man, we see this character, we want him to be cool. So that's almost like the, the cliched the expected thing when we see ourselves on screen playing action heroes. But very rarely do we see ourselves in action movies where we're not the best person holding the gun and we're not the person who has all figured out, we're not the bravest. So to start with Harp -- where we find him, this hot shot great drone pilot whose thrust on the front lines alongside Captain Leo and has no idea what he's doing on the front lines, is scared of every explosion, to what we get to at the end of the movie where he's having to overcome adversity and to save the world. It was, it was exciting to me, man. I wanted to go on a journey. I was attracted to the arc of the character. And I thought it would be something fresh to show us in a different light.
Sylvia: Yeah.
Scottie: I'm not going to lie to you. I was screaming at you. I was screaming at you. [laughter] When you was hiding behind that truck, I was like, if you don't get yourself together.
Damson: Harp, you don't start acting like Franklin. [laughter]
Scottie: For real! Buck up!
Sylvia: I --.
Scottie: What's wrong with you?
Sylvia: I was -- meanwhile I was like, me, if I ever got put in a war [laughs] I was like relatable. Finally, a soldier that I could relate to. Hiding behind the truck. Like I ain't about to die for y'all. What?
Scottie: [crosstalk] Facts. Facts. It's crazy. But what was most challenging with bringing this script to life? I know you've had a lot of fun with it, but is there anything that was most challenging?
Damson: The biggest challenge for me was just I like to really understand and live in a character's soul. And to play a drone pilot of what I learned from watching movies such as Eye In the Sky and Ethan Hawke's Good Kill was that, wasn't spoken enough about is the PTSD and trauma that comes alongside with being a drone pilot, you know. You're sitting in a chair Sargent's desk for months and you're looking at a location. And you know, you're looking at a little girl who sells bread every morning or that family or dad that walks his son to school. And as soon as your target is in that location, you need to forget about that report that you've built with all of these individual people and just press a button when you're ordered to. And that could have a lasting effect on you when you go home. So that was the biggest thing for me, to understand Harp's level of trauma.
Scottie: Right.
Damson: He's -- they say he's a brilliant drone pilot and Leah refers to him as being cold and calculated. So I wanted to understand that Harp isn't like that. But I wanted to understand that he definitely works with people like that. I wanted to understand the weight of being a drone pilot and the power that's actually at your fingertips.
Scottie: Right. And when doing this work, you know, how have you managed to take care of yourself while doing that kind of connecting?
Damson: It's interesting, man. Sometimes I, I get a bit too deep into characters, I think. But, you know, traveling was something that was really good for me. As I said, fortunately, this was a period -- this was 2019 that we shot this. We were in Hungary, Budapest. So when I wasn't on set, I was able to walk around the city and just enjoy the history of Budapest and eat their food and drink their liquor.
Sylvia: [laughs] Is it different?
Damson: Oh, yeah, yeah. [laughter] It's strong. Oh, It's strong, man. There was a bar called the Bob that was right next to the Four Seasons. So any time I felt like I was too in my head I'd head over to the Bob and have a glass of red wine with, with Anthony Mackie. But there was -- those were ways I could get out of, get out of my head.
Sylvia: Right. And you you spoke a bit about Anthony Mackie and how excited you were to work with him on this project. What were some of your favorite moments working with him? Is there any lessons as an actor you got from him? You know, it felt very like big bro, little bro. Like why -- with you guys on the scenes. Was it like that behind the scenes as well?
Damson: 100 percent, man. Mackie is is my big brother. I call him and bother him too much. So I'm definitely his younger brother. But just just with regards to codes of navigating this industry, he spoke to me about humility, a lot. He was like, you're in the light, kid. You know, you're in the light. And and a lot of ego comes with that. You're going to have a lot of yes men around you. Sometimes I'm going to say, no. Don't slip at that person, cherish that person that I said no. He spoke to me about the highs and lows of the industry. Sometimes your loved, sometimes your not. But the biggest thing he taught me without actually vocalizing it was happiness. And that's something that a lot of people don't speak about enough in our industry. But to look at someone like Anthony Mackie, being in a position I'm in, a young starting out actor, and looking at a more seasoned actor who's done over 70 movies. And he's still happy. And so he lets me know that I can be happy one day in that position, too. And one thing that's not spoken about is, a lot of people have it all but aren't happy. So Mackie told me that you can be.
Sylvia: I love that.
Scottie: I love that. I actually wanted to ask you, you know, navigating through this industry, what has surprised you recently about yourself as an actor?
Damson: I think it's the the pandemic. I think it's the pandemic. You the pandemic has made me ask myself, Damson, who are you outside of acting? Who are you outside of what you do? Right. And it's made me again to new interests. I play Call of Duty and Fifa too much. I'm trying to get as close to family as possible. As an actor I'm away from them so much. So I think it's just the times has taught me how to navigate this industry. When we finally get back to doing what we love, I'm going to focus on putting those things first. Family, time with family. There's been moments where I've been invited to do things with family where I said, Oh, but this movie, Mom. You know, this movie is going to pay me this. Or oh, I can't come to my nephew's thing because, because this fashion shows doing this. You know and then, you go to these things in your suit and boot and you look pretty and you take a picture. But.
Scottie: But do you even remember it? Like this certain events that I went to last year that I'm like, I don't even remember those things. I remember none of it. But I remember hanging out with my family and, you know, the constant language that, you know, I was speaking with my family and and being able to embrace them and touch them and stuff like that. You know what I'm saying? That's what mattered the most. But I didn't get to see that until quarantine. Until it was taken from me, you know.
Damson: Exactly. And there's been so many sacrifices during this time, of course. And we all must be respectful to that. But there's also been a lot to gain spiritually, mentally through this time. And I hope just as a society and humanity in general, we're able to take some good draws from this time and apply it to and finally get back to normal.
Sylvia: It's funny that Scottie had mentioned talk -- talked about events that we don't remember. One, I'm sure you don't remember is I was at the Oscars in 2018 when John Singleton brought you to the Oscars. And I was there doing inside the theater kind of interviewing because this is what people don't know about the Oscars. I'ma tell -- I'm gonna put people on game real quick. There was a whole ass open bar in the middle of the Oscars. Like you can be in the theater in your seat but most people are at the bar! Like you ever wonder if people are getting bored. I'm like, so this is how they keep the A-listers entertained during this entire ceremony. [laughter] So I was, I was tasked with being at the bar to get quotes on people about some of the winners at my old job. And I aswJohn Singleton at the bar. And I literally was like, it was the -- Jordan Peele was up for a direct -- but, you know, it was going to be a big moment and he ended up winning. But I wanted to get John Singleton's thoughts on that moment, you know. And he did not want to talk to me about Jordan Peele. You know, who he wanted to talk to me about? You and Snowfall. He was like, he said, you know, I'm happy for Jordan, blah blah blah blah. But let me talk to you about my man, Damson, right here. And I was like, he was like, who, who I want you to write about and who -- what show I'm very passionate about now is Snowfall. He he bigged you up so much and talked about your talent like. And I just thought that was so beautiful because he's been in the game. He wasn't -- at that point, you know, he'd been in the game for so long. He's a legend. What did it mean to you to have been ushered into Hollywood, like literally ushered in by one of the most beloved legends that we had?
Damson: I felt like the luckiest young actor in the world. And every actor doesn't get that privilege, man. And in fact, every actor did get that privilege, they'd get to where they want to get to a lot sooner. You know, John, he taught me everything, basically. Because I -- when I came to L.A., I didn't know anything. I had been doing like plays and and kind of small parts of movies and TV back home in London. So to be put in the limelight, it's like you talk about that Oscar party. I remember the Variety party right after, right. And one thing about me, I've always been someone who sat home and and Googled stuff that's coming up. Right, because I always want to be 20 years ahead. Right, so even if the opportunity hasn't come, when I was 20 years old, even though I didn't go to the Oscars until I was around 23, 24 I already knew what the Vanity Fair party was. I know you take pictures. I know they give you In and Out burgers. I knew all this stuff, right. So we get there and I'm expecting them to take a picture with John. And I was going to walk right in with them. They're not gonna want to picture me, right. John tells all these photographers: this is Damson Idris. He's the new lead on my show, Snowfall. Forget about me. Take pictures of him.
Sylvia: Literally. That's all he was saying that whole night. [laughs]
Damson: Young actors that always get that. So what John's taught me is, as I'm moving on in my career, is to find that young actor that I can give that to, too. That's what it's about. It's about the tether and it's about pulling people up with you. So that's what John taught me.
Sylvia: I love that. I love that you mentioned that because last season, the season one, we had another actor that John, John ushered in, ia Long, as a guest on our podcast. And she talked about how we, like the young Black creatives and the freedoms and opportunities we have as a result of their work makes us their legacy. You know, like she was like, she looked at us, Scottie literally changed her Twitter name for like six months and called us like, you are my legacy, you know? And then she was like --
Scottie: [crosstalk] Yeah, she said we are an extension of her.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] An extension of her legacy.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Extension, Damson.
Sylvia: Like when she sees free Black women and creatives doing what they do, she's like that's what I fought for. And I feel like, you know, it's the same thing with -- you know, in a lot of ways, with a lot of us creatives and, you very much have a direct line, you know, snowfall is John's living leg -- you know, the legacy that is continuing past his death. And what does carrying on John Singleton's legacy look like to you? You mentioned wanting to usher in, you know, like another actor in that way. But even when you consider, like, your work and your career, do you have any thoughts on how you're going to continue to carry that on?
Damson: Well, there's a lot of projects, for instance, that John would talk to me about. So as I'm moving into producing, which I am now, it's about bringing those projects to fruition and helping however I can to the people involved. He worked with a lot of people and he launched a lot of careers. So it's about working with those people. Some of those seasoned actors. The thing we have in common is, John. So the magic we make is going to be special. And it's about creating more opportunities. But one thing I'm fortunate about is many of the actors that I admire weren't leading TV shows and lead in movies when they were 23, 24, 29. They, they weren't doing that. They didn't get those opportunities until they're in their 40s. That's why a lot of our Black superheroes are in their 40s. If you notice, you know. It took that generation a longer time to be accepted. A new thing you're seeing now is a lot of young Black actors are producing now. So it's about us creating more work for people. That's essentially what it is. The more power I get, the more I'm in the room and the more people I could bring with me. That's what John taught me and that's exactly what I'm going to do going forward.
Scottie: That's super powerful. That is very powerful. The new season of Snowfall premieres February 24th. So, you know, how would you describe this next chapter of the series? What should fans expect? Fans like me who, when you came out [laughter] -- when you came out in that cane, Franklin, let me tell you something. I was pissed.
Damson: Blame Melody. This season, so Season four snowfall starts January 1st, so it's New Year's Day. It's 1985. The Reagan administration has launched the war on drugs, of course, and it's rampant. So we're dealing as a crew with iner and outer conflict. We're dealing with pressure from law enforcement. And Franklin specifically is trying to juggle the legality of running his mum's real estate business and the illegal side running his empire. A lot of people were drawn to the Franklin season and rightly so. This is something that many of us identify with. Franklin represents our uncles, our cousins, our brothers. And we work for him no matter what he does.
Scottie: I don't care what Franklin does. I'm a ride to the wheels fall off. It don't matter.
Damson: But I want people to focus on on the role that that Teddy McDonald plays. I want them to focus on how everything he does directly affects what happens in everyone else's life. But just as always, you're going to be on edge of your seat. And it is a show that's deeply rooted in history, deeper -- deeply rooted in truth. And despite John being absent, he's still with us spiritually. And we will not let you down.
Sylvia: To circle back to the conversation about, you know, whether it's Snowfall season -- which we're very excited about -- or Outside the Wire. It's pretty, at this point I feel like in Hollywood it's pretty clear that movies and shows starring Black actors will perform well, which, you know, we're hoping will always push to more diversity in these projects. What stories are you looking forward to being told next? Like, what do you -- what do you want it -- like, if you could create like, this is what I want to do next?
Damson: Well, we are. I'm deeply focused on Africa right now because I think Africa is what brings us all together. And just from every year a bunch of influences. We -- we, you know, we will do Christmas in Ghana, we'll do Christmas in, in Nigeria. And the range of people from different backgrounds is something to marvel at. Be it, people from London, people from America, and vice versa. So it's just about telling those stories and getting as many actors involved as possible. I'd love to tell a story that's about 1950s Nigeria starring Daniel Kaluuya and, and then and Jonathan Majors and and an actor from Brazil.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Yes!
Damson: And I feel like African stories really do bring us closer together and it was evident in Black Panther. You know. That's that's something that creates the unity. So it's about focusing more on African stories for me. I want those stories being told. I'd love to see more stories cross over from the UK on a global scale along the lines of Small Acts. A lot of people don't know a lot about my background and everything I tell them is brand new. And I'm like, yo, how do you guys not know this? And it's because the arc hasn't come over here, be it on a large scale with music or on a large scale, with movies in general. And shows like Small Acts educate people in the states to know that we're -- it's not all tea and crumpets. [laughter] And everyone doesn't work for [Music In]6 either. You know there are some men who are just talk like me, get me, there's some people who are just from the hood, there's some people who aren't from the hood but don't sound like that. There's some people who experience insane amounts of racial tension. And and there's some people who are entrepreneurs who started from the ground up. There's so many stories.
Sylvia: Yeah.
Damson: There's immigrant. There's a huge correlation, basically.
Sylvia: We love a strategy. We love a strategy.
Damson: [crosstalk] Yes. [laughs].
Sylvia: And I as -- you know, I'm first generation. My parents are Kenyan. Most of my family is in Kenya or in London. And then, you know, we have the American cousins. So like the diaspora is very much in my extended family. And I love the idea of seeing that brought -- like those differences brought to media. Because we are like -- you know, I'm the -- you know, I am the American cousin. That's what call -- oh Sylvia, our cousin in the States, is what they say.
Scottie: [crosstalk] Awww.
Sylvia: But then they say, but then you know, I'll go -- I'll go home. You know, I'll go to Nairobi and there's tea time, tea and crumpets and all the things because, you know, colonization. [laughs] But, you know -- and then but in London, you know, visit your aunties there. Like it's it's it's such a rich and like nuanced differences. But what I love is that I can see the root of us in each place and that is Africa. So I love that that's what you want to do next because it's so necessary. The onl -- the last -- and I promise we're done after this is like, I was going to ask you if there was a tip that you could give our listeners on a good way to express interest in a man. Because we're not men. So that's not a question we can never answer for them. And since we had you here, I was wondering --.
Scottie: And I know you don't lie Damson, that's for sure.
Sylvia: [laughs] I was wondering, what your thoughts were.
Damson: Okay, we could talk about the elephant in the room, which is the first time to be intimate with that new person. Right. Okay, that time span is often dictated by your history in the past or your experiences in the past. One thing I will say about men -- and I'm sorry, guys, I'm about to throw you under the bus. [laughter] A guy will wait for the first date and he will also wait for a year. In between that time where you think he's waiting for you, he's with other people. Have that in the back of your head and I think you'll be better prepared for if you make him wait in a year and he turns out to be a demon [laughter] after you give him your temple. That's -- I'm throwing you guys under the bus! [laughter].
Scottie: [crosstalk] I love how he says, you guys. Cus it has nothing to do with him.
Damson: [crosstalk] That is something all women should know.
Scottie: [crosstalk] I'm calling you guys out.
Sylvia: [crosstalk] Excluding himself. Men like that. Not me, though.
Scottie: The men like that, not me.
Damson: Yeah. Not, not me. [laughter] But everyone else -- every other man but not me. But but yeah, I -- That's it. That's -- I think that's, that's what I told my sisters. That's what I told my niece. That's what I'm going to tell my daughter one day is to always have in your head that he ain't S-H-I-T. Make him prove that that that he is, you know. Make a guy work a bit, I think.
Sylvia: Thank you so much for coming and sitting with us and talking with us. I really feel like we're friends after this. You know, like we're very looking and exc -- you know, we're very excited about your career and where it's heading and we can't wait to keep watching you soar.
Damson: And I can't wait to see this podcast soar even greater as well.
Scottie: Oh, thank you. It is soaring. It's great. [laughter] It's doing well. The numbers are there. [laughter] The numbers show. We almost there. So, yes. Thank you so much Damson for sitting with us.
Damson: Bless you. Thanks, guys.
[Music In]
Sylvia: Alright. That's our show. Thank you all for tuning in. And thanks again to Damson Idris for chatting with us today and giving us a little relationship, dating advice tips with his cute self. [laughs]
Scottie: Okay? Our show is a production of Pineapple Street Studios in partnership with Netflix and Strong Black Lead. Shout out to our team. Executive Producers are Agerenesh Ashagre and Danielle Cadet. Our Lead Producer is Jess Jupiter. Our music is by Amanda Jones. Special thanks to Max Linsky and Jenna Weiss-Berman.
Sylvia: Make sure you share your thoughts with us on the episode using the #okaynowlisten. Follow Strong Black Lead on the socials @strongblack lead. And follow us too. I'm @sylviaobell.
Scottie: And I'm @scottiebeam.
Sylvia: Until next time, folks, stay blessed.
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